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Tactical Help!


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#1 Patrick Elliott

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 01:59 PM

Ever since the release of FM14 I have seriously struggled to come up with a tactic which is any good, really finding it hard understanding the new tactic system. Not saying its bad, just wanting to learn exactly what I can do to make a working tactic. I have had a lot of success in the past FM games but this one has had be stumped.

 

Any advice would be amazing.

 

Thank you.  



#2 Jake Lenahan

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 02:56 PM

I think this version just works on common sense really. It's less about making some crazy, complicated tactic but a more simplistic and effective one. 

 

So for example, I'll give you a scenario:

 

Say you were West Ham, away to Arsenal (just started the new season). Instinct would have you play a 4-5-1 to make sure you pack out the midfield and limit their creative midfielders. Probably want to make sure you play a counter attacking strategy as you won't see much of the ball, but want to have some attacking presence. Make sure the shouts are set to Press/Aggressive/Run at Defence/Overlap so when you get the ball from being aggressive and press heavy in the middle, you break at speed and have your fullbacks on the overlap (since you have Jarvis who could cause some damage). Then you look at your squad and what roles they will play. Maybe playing Diame as a Half Back or something so he stops Ozil floating in-between your defence and midfield. 

 

You may not have the players for the given roles, but thats the risk of being a manager. Can I play Diame there at Half-Back even though he is only rated 2 stars? Will he still do the job and limit Ozil? Is he better playing as an Anchor? 

 

It's just little things like that really that gets you thinking. It's more of a 'reactive' game than the previous version, so just make sure you study the scout report and how to 'solve' certain situations and you'll be fine :)


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#3 Jack

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 09:15 PM

The only save I'm doing well in at the moment is one where I am not using my own tactic 100%, so I'm in the same position as Patrick. Thanks for the tips Jake, hopefully I'll begin to do well. It's interesting that you said about fancy tactics though, as I've often tried three at the back and all of that stuff ;)


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#4 Patrick Elliott

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 11:01 PM

It just seems at the moment, regardless of how well my friendly fixtures went and how well I think things are going, we start the season and it all falls apart, conceding loads of goals, not scoring, regardless of how much possession I may have.

 

Finding it really hard to do anything :( 



#5 Jake Lenahan

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 11:15 PM

It just seems at the moment, regardless of how well my friendly fixtures went and how well I think things are going, we start the season and it all falls apart, conceding loads of goals, not scoring, regardless of how much possession I may have.

 

Finding it really hard to do anything :(

 

Can you just give me a brief back-story about your save and we'll try and help you :)



#6 Patrick Elliott

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Posted 17 November 2013 - 11:23 PM

To be honest this has happened for a lot of saves I have started. When try to manage arsenal I just can't seem to get the ball rolling, I remember my first game was at home against stoke and we lost 3-0 even though we had much more possession then them we just couldn't score, this is just case. I just can't seem to get a Winning tactic regardless of who I may be
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#7 Jake Lenahan

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 12:29 AM

This may sound odd, but have you ever thought about going to Asia and playing in Hong Kong/Malaysia/Singapore? The learning curve is a lot less steep so you should find some success there, giving you the basics to go and manage with the big teams in Europe.



#8 Patrick Elliott

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 11:27 AM

Hmm Interesting. I shall give it a go and that way I can post some information here, to give you a better idea of what I am doing :) Thanks for the help. 



#9 Chris/Morozov95

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 11:43 AM

Any luck yet Patrick? Maybe post your tactic and team instructions for feedback if you wish.

All the best :)


FM Mentality - "Never take your foot off the pedal."

 

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#10 GinBlossom89

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Posted 21 November 2013 - 05:31 AM

hey guys. anyone can give me a hand on my tactic? i made a few games with many teams and this tactic, despite good attacking movements, has serious defensive problems. my middle defender doesnt't cover as he was called to (actually he and my attackers usually have poor perfomances) and usually blocks the player in the possession of the ball, which allows some midfielder to enter from behind to his back and the other 2 central defender can't reach on time. when the other team plays with only one attacker this often happens. another problem is when the other team is moving by the flanks and when they are close to the final line they make passes to their midfielders, waiting close to the area to shoot. my defenses and midfielders join inside the area, sometimes with 7 guys against 2 of them and don't make opposition to their midfielders. these are some of the problems i got. i ask someone expert on tactics to test my tactic and give me some advices, not only about these problems but also against other thing that are not right at all or things that you may think that aren't. cheers!  

 

http://www.mediafire...2 attacking.tac

 

p.s.-the instructions are predefined to atletico madrid. my usual team is:

                     courtois

alderweireld  miranda  balanta

juanfran                       filipe

       koke          javi.garcia

                turan

        villa           diego.costa



#11 The Great Matsby

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 08:30 PM

Hi Patrick

 

I'm something of an FM/CM veteran as I've been playing one version or another for 18 years but even I'm finding this one difficult. The main thing to do is not to over think things. In this version more than any other I think it is essential to follow the step by steps set out in the tactics creator after assessing your players. I admit that the first time I tried this I ended up with the weirdest 4-2-2-2 I've ever seen and my first two fixtures were a 4-3 win over Newcastle and an 8-1 defeat at Man Utd, Hardly easy to find any clues as to what I'd done right or what I'd done wrong! However I stuck with it, noted what my assistant said in-game and how often and adjusted my formation, player roles and team instructions accordingly. I had a workable tactic after season 1 and, most importantly, I'm enjoying using something that I've come up with rather than a pre-set or another managers formation. 

 

The best advice I can give is when starting a new save don't get frustrated if you get beaten. These matches all give you stats and information that can be used to tweak your tactic going forward.


Matt


#12 Ainvar

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 03:18 PM

I am on the same boat as you Patrick, probably there is a way to get things working but I still have to find it out. I spent all weekend with a new save, planning everything and taking note of every detail, I took care of each player and came up with two tactics that I thought were going to be very good but, in the end, nothing seems working. I can only put the hands in my hair looking at all the preparation resulting useless :(.



#13 RadicalEd

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Posted 27 November 2013 - 10:10 AM

Well I'm kind of new to the FM series in general. But I played three saves for a season or longer so far(two pretty bad german first division sides: Freiburg and Nurnberg, and a decent third division side: Rostock), and I always come back to the same tactic, with slight variations. So far I posted amazing results with Freiburg and Rostock and decent results with Nurnberg, but at Nurnberg the tactic didn't really fit the squad.

 

I like to play 4-1-4-1

------------GK--------------

FB----CD----BPD-----FB

-------RGA/BMW---------

-------DLP----BBM-------

IF------------------------W

----------P/TM------------

 

Instructions(usually): Play it short, retain posession, hassle opponents, get stuck in, Play wider, exploit flanks, look for overlap

Rigid and Counter/Control, depending on opposition.

 

Player roles and instructions depend heavily on the Squad of course, but the main jist of the tactic is to cut the offensive playmaker out of the usual 4-2-3-1 and put him as a defensive midfielder behind your central  midfielder  instead. As a  trade off  you get to play with very offensive wingers, and if you got pacey FBs you can set them on Attack duty as well. This tactic worked especially well for me if you got a Target man who has decent heading/finishing. You CM/DM should be good at passing and  at least  one of them has to have decent creativity, or you will struggle with creating chances. Your attacking midfielders need to be good players, because they need to both score goals and create chances, or you will struggle to score enough goals.

Generally i found this tactic gives you amazing defensive stability, while being a bit problematic on the offensive side, because if your  striker  goes on a bad run and you have  no decent backup your season is basically over, because you will get a lot of 0-0. 0-1 and 1-2. But if you have atleast 2 decent strikers in your squad, I'd say give it a go.


Freiburg Squad, Season 3 (2015/2016)

------------------Baumann------------------

Andre----Milosevic---Ginter----Ozcipka

-----------------Casemiro------------------

-----------Eremenko---Khedira-----------

Schmidt-----------------------------Brandt

-------------------Destro--------------------


#14 NikoZolo

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 06:38 AM

Sometimes people tend to overthink tactics. I always used to use obscure formations with odd positions and exotic roles. Best to keep it simple in the beginning. Maybe just flat lines in a 4-3-3 or 4-4-2 with some advanced roles and defensive roles mixed in to give it shape. As you learn more about your players and add some extra ones in the transfer market then you already have a good base and just need to make small changes here and there. Had a bit of trouble with the new tactics but if you do your research, find someone else's tactic and make the little changes here and there to suit your players and add balance then you should be good (just remember to thank them for the inspiration). Hope all of this helps. I just don't have the time to test.

#15 Chris/Morozov95

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 10:56 AM

I agree with Niko's comments, start with something basic like a 4-4-2 or 4-5-1, then tinker with the roles until you have something that works.

Darren posted a good article on the main FMS site about the effect of player movement, which is worth a read. It's not just how the formation looks on the tactics screen, but how it flows on match day offensively and defensively.

Try not to give up on a tactic if it doesn't work after one or two games. Remember that it takes time for the players to become accustomed to the tactic and for you to ascertain whether certain player roles are effective or ineffective. I think 5 or 6 competitive matches is usually a good guide.

And hey, failing all that, use someone else's tactic and bring in players that fit the tactic. Have fun with it! :)

FM Mentality - "Never take your foot off the pedal."

 

Come over and read my Aldershot Town story here


#16 Ainvar

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 06:57 PM

Well those messages restored some faith in me, despite I had another unsuccessful weekend were I played to October and I was sacked, gathering only 2 wins in Friendlies and nothing more than draws in the league.

 

I was playing in the Skrill North and I tried to keep it simple with a 4-4-2, but now some questions arise:

 

is it better to give NO player instructions at all at this low level? Maybe I ask too much of my players and as a result everything goes worse;

is it better to give little (5) to noone team instructions in general and just change the tactic before each match, according to the opposition?

same goes with the player roles, I never change them as I am afraid I will ruin the knowledge of my team but I notice in youtube videos that a lot of players just switch them and the results are positive;

another thing is I always try to mix the mentality of players on the pitch; I always put defend/support in defense; support/defend/attack in midfield and attack/support in attack but maybe that is not required? I am afraid that with 2 attack strikers they will not be linked to the midfield, but again, at this point I am really confused about it all :/

 

I am kinda put off by all this, I try to not overthink but I think I end up creating a lot of "what if?", so if someone could clear the doubts it'd be appreciated.

Thankfully I can just switch to my Juve save and happily smash oppositions to feel better :)



#17 NikoZolo

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Posted 04 December 2013 - 08:35 AM

Hey Ainvar, you seem to be on the right track but I'll try and give some little tips as to how I start up a save. Basically, when i'm starting with a team that I'm unfamiliar with or haven't used I take a look at their players and decide not necessarily who is the best but where we are deepest. If you have 6-7 wingers then I utilize the flanks and rotate so they stay fresh. If I have a wealth of midfielders then I try at least 3 in the middle. Build your tactic around your team. Always keep it basic when it comes to roles. Interchange their "stance" (attack, support, etc) but never in the defence. Have a tactic for controlling matches (4-3-3 or 4-5-1) and a counter tactic to soak up pressure (4-4-1-1 or 4-1-4-1). When it comes to player instructions, if I'm in the lower leagues I only give them instructions that prevent them from doing something (ie shoot less often, try less risky passes, stay on feet) but only do this if you feel a player doesn't have enough quality. After a few games you will know who shouldn't go into tackles 100% or who shouldn't shoot from distance.

Hope this helps as I'm at work and it might be all jumbled. What team are you using if I may ask for your lower league saves?

#18 Ainvar

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Posted 04 December 2013 - 10:03 AM

Thanks Niko, very valuable hints :). I am with Leamington right now, despite they are predicted to finish last they do have an ok squad for mid table in my view.



#19 lawliet

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Posted 27 December 2013 - 01:39 AM

Hi, i need help how can i improve flair ?



#20 NikoZolo

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Posted 27 December 2013 - 08:15 PM

Lawliet, in my experience "flair" is inherited. Meaning a player has a natural inclination to develop it. I can't just pick a player in defense and give him flair for training. 1) either buy players with high "flair" and develop around it 2) play these players in advanced positions that use it so they can develop it in-game (IF, AP, SS) 3) or have a player on your team with high flair tutor a player and hope that the attributes are inherited. Hope that helps




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